Merkava MBT (Izrael)

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De komolyan kérdezem! Miért?

Ez megint olyan mint a Leclerc esete.
A Merkava I-II nem volt elég jó.
A Merkava III már elég jó volt, csak véget ért a HH és így kutya sem vett új tankot majd 20 évig. Szóval nem volt piac.
A Merkava ellen nem érv az, hogy nem volt exportálva. A koreai K2 sem volt exportálva, aztán a Lengyelek befizettek 1000 db-ra.
Mindig van egy első export ügyfél.

Ha meg attól jó egy tank, hogy sok helyre exportálták, akkor a T-54/55 nek nincs ellenfele :D
 
Miért is? Ha hiszed vagy sem egy harceszköz beszerzésénél ez egy fontos szempont , az pedig, hogy a pajeszosok sokáig nem gondolkodtak a Merkavák exportjában arról csakis ők tehetnek..

A cikk fizetős, de időben sikerült lementenem:


Peres suggested selling up to half the production of Merkava tanks, 10 a month, at $810,000 each for an order of at least 1,000 tanks.

Ez volt már 1990 előtt.
 
Nekem pont ez a szívemnek kedves kombó egyébként.
Krisss ne csalódjak benned :) te is tudod mennyi CV robbant le a gyakorlaton nálunk a Hollandoknak :) Ültél mindkettőben azért Lynx kényelmesebb gép. K2 nekem is tetszett sajnos nem volt alkalmam beleülni ,de amikor “napvilágot” látott a páncél védettsége hát… többre számítottam Leo A7+ védettebb azért. Lengyeleknél megnézem,majd mekkora a hely benne.
 
A Merkavát a Leopardal szemben hováexportálták?Vagy máshogy is fel lehet tenni a kérdést a Merkavát Izraelen kívül melyik másik ország hadereje rendszeresítette? A válasz az , hogy senki ez az egyik oka annak, hogy a Leopárd nagyobb export sikereket ér el mint a Merkava.
Nem ért el,mert nem volt létszükséglet számunkra az export legutóbb Columbiának akarták eladni. Nem is látod a Merkavat a kiállításokon nem tolják a Marketinget nem véletlenül.
 
A Merkavát a Leopardal szemben hováexportálták?Vagy máshogy is fel lehet tenni a kérdést a Merkavát Izraelen kívül melyik másik ország hadereje rendszeresítette? A válasz az , hogy senki ez az egyik oka annak, hogy a Leopárd nagyobb export sikereket ér el mint a Merkava.

Nem ért el,mert nem volt létszükséglet számunkra az export legutóbb Columbiának akarták eladni. Nem is látod a Merkavat a kiállításokon nem tolják a Marketinget nem véletlenül.

Ennyi exportsikere azért van.
 
Nem tudom mennyire számít, hogy a Merkava IV-nek (V-nek) L/44-es hk ágyúja van (nota bene! RM licenc alapján továbbfejlesztett), míg az A7 L/55-össel rendelkezik.
 
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Reactions: Venom85
Nem tudom mennyire számít, hogy a Merkava IV-nek (V-nek) L/44-es hk ágyúja van (nota bene! RM licenc alapján továbbfejlesztett), míg az A7 L/55-össel rendelkezik.
Számít nyilván az L55 jobb főleg a legújabb verziója, de a Merkava “L/44”-e brutális nyomáson dolgozik közelíti adatokban. Eszi is a csövet rendesen.
 
Számít nyilván az L55 jobb főleg a legújabb verziója, de a Merkava “L/44”-e brutális nyomáson dolgozik közelíti adatokban. Eszi is a csövet rendesen.

Biztos jobb az L55-ös, mérlegelni kell, hogy a kb. 1millió(+ ?) $-ral drágább cső jobb-e amikor kilövi a kb. ATGM-árú APFSD-t, de csak max. 3km-re, amit a kevéssel drágább Spike már akár NLOS-ként is tud, 10+ vagy akár dupla km-re.
Hoppá!

Nem szabad egy kiragadott paramétert döntőnek tekinteni, rossz döntéshez vezet!
...lásd: "Zrínyi"!


Ugyanezért, ugyan-ezen gondolatmenet mentén --költség-hatékonyság !!! -- nincs értelme az L60-as Pzh-2000-nek sem az ugyanúgy precíziós, hasonló (lőszer)árú, de sokkal-sokkal megfizethetőbb, töredék eszköz-árú, és ráadásul sokkal nagyobb tűzgyorsaságú, +lő-távú rakéta-tüzérséggel szemben.
Nem meglepő módon mindkét esetben a rokon konstrukciójú, működési elvű, sokkal megfizethetőbb árú harci eszköz a nyertes a katona-szakmai szempontú költséghatékonysági versenyben!
  1. ...Politika nélkül!
  2. ...szerintem!

.
 

Több száz régi Merkava tank útban Európába: minden részlet a történelmi megállapodásról​

 

Több száz régi Merkava tank útban Európába: minden részlet a történelmi megállapodásról​

Mit ír a cikk?
 
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Reactions: Kim Philby

Hundreds of old Merkava Tanks on the way to Europe: all the details about the historic deal​

40 years after they entered service in the IDF, hundreds of Merkava tanks of the 2nd and 3rd marks are expected to be sold to two foreign countries, including for the first time to a European country. The tanks went out of use in recent years, remaining in warehouses - but after the start of the war in Ukraine and the renewed demand for armored war vehicles, they were tested and found to be suitable enough to sell​




3Viewing the gallery
Salute to Merkava Mark 2 tank

Chariot Mark 2 tank, archive

( Photo: Haim Hornstein )

One of the Israeli symbols is being exported to Europe for the first time: 40 years after they entered service in the IDF, old Merkava tanks manufactured in Israel are expected to be sold soon to two foreign armies, reach Europe, and continue to serve despite their advanced age.

The US Department of Defense should soon approve to Israel the sale of hundreds of Merkava Mark 2 and 3 tanks that were manufactured in Israel in the 1980s and 1990s and have been decommissioned in recent years to two foreign countries, one of them in Europe, against the background of the war in Ukraine and the refinement to which classic armored war vehicles are being re-acquired. This is the first time that Merkava tanks will be sold to a European country.

The Ministry of Defense does not specify the names of the two countries that agreed on the purchase of more than 200 used Israeli tanks in light of the sensitivity of the process, but the deal is on the verge of a final signature and is expected to be completed relatively immediately, within about three months. Officials at the Ministry of Defense told Ynet that since certain mechanical parts in these tanks are American-made, especially the engine, approval from the Ministry of Defense in Washington is required to carry out the transaction.

According to estimates, the scope of the deal will reach several tens of millions of dollars for all the tanks, an amount that will enter the state coffers and will probably be transferred directly to the defense establishment. This is an amount that is considered negligible in relation to the purchase of new western tanks. For the sake of proportion, about a decade ago, the Ministry of Defense offered a foreign army to purchase a new Mark 4 Merkava tank, from the production line, for approximately four million dollars per tank.

details indicate that the two transactions will be split - one will include the older Merkava 2 tanks and the other the Merkava Mark 3 that entered service in the nineties and served mainly the fighters of the 188th Brigade. In recent years these tanks have fallen out of use and today all 3 regular armored brigades - 401, 188 and 7th Brigade - equipped with advanced Merkava Mark 4 tanks with the active defense system against anti-tank missiles, of the wind jacket type and computerized command and control systems.

Some of the regular tanks, especially those with less experience, were transferred to reserve brigades, including the 10th (Harel) brigade instead of the tanks. However, more than 200 orphaned tanks remain in the IDF's maintenance depots. At first, the defense establishment was pessimistic about the possibility of a foreign army purchasing them, and the possibility of selling them to iron recycling contractors was considered, but not before they were scrapped. But the counter-armaments will strengthen them well and at the same time the war between Russia and Ukraine broke out last year, which changed the security needs of European countries. Initial interest in used tanks began already in the middle of last year and the Ministry of Defense rushed to check the condition of the old tanks, and found that they were serviceable enough to be sold.



It is difficult to sell military surpluses, we try to prolong their lives as much as possible

"It is difficult to sell military surpluses, we try to prolong their lives as much as possible"

( Photo: IDF spokesman )

Security officials explained that "producing a tank as an off-the-shelf product is a complex and long process that can take two years and cost a fortune, in our time there are tanks that are qualified, with receipts, for operation tomorrow morning, in open and built-up areas." The sources also said that "Europe is in an arms race that has not been the same since World War II." For example, the German Ministry of Defense tripled its defense budget because of the tensions with Russia, while Sweden and Finland join NATO, and only yesterday the Israeli Ministry of Defense reported an all-time record in the sale of Israeli weapons to the world - approximately 12.5 billion dollars in the past year.

It should be noted that in the IDF's warehouses there are still hundreds of M-113 APCs that are also going out of use, in light of the introduction of the NMR and Eitan APCs in recent years, mainly to the regular brigades. For these APCs, which are not considered protected from anti-tank fire, there is still no foreign demand. At the same time, in recent years, Israel has succeeded in promoting the sale of decommissioned Air Force F-16 aircraft to the Croatian army. The security officials stated that "it is difficult to sell military surpluses, and we are trying to be attractive and extend their lives as much as possible."

The first chariot tanks, the product of the development of Major General Israel Tal (Telik) and the engineer Israel Tilan, were produced in Israel in the late 1970s, and their first version, the Mark 1, was integrated into operational activity already in the First Lebanon War, during Operation Peace of the Galilee. Immediately after that, the Ministry of Defense developed the follow-up version, Mark 2, with improvements that allowed warfare even in built-up areas, and with additions for passive protection. Regular and reserve armored personnel carriers recorded thousands of successful battles in chariot tanks in all recent Israeli systems, in the security zone in Lebanon, in Operation Protective Wall, in the Second Lebanon War, in operations in the Gaza Strip before and after disengagement, as well as in ongoing security in the various sectors.
 

Több száz régi Merkava tank útban Európába: minden részlet a történelmi megállapodásról​

Hova?
 

Hundreds of old Merkava Tanks on the way to Europe: all the details about the historic deal​

40 years after they entered service in the IDF, hundreds of Merkava tanks of the 2nd and 3rd marks are expected to be sold to two foreign countries, including for the first time to a European country. The tanks went out of use in recent years, remaining in warehouses - but after the start of the war in Ukraine and the renewed demand for armored war vehicles, they were tested and found to be suitable enough to sell​




3Viewing the gallery
Salute to Merkava Mark 2 tank

Chariot Mark 2 tank, archive

( Photo: Haim Hornstein )

One of the Israeli symbols is being exported to Europe for the first time: 40 years after they entered service in the IDF, old Merkava tanks manufactured in Israel are expected to be sold soon to two foreign armies, reach Europe, and continue to serve despite their advanced age.

The US Department of Defense should soon approve to Israel the sale of hundreds of Merkava Mark 2 and 3 tanks that were manufactured in Israel in the 1980s and 1990s and have been decommissioned in recent years to two foreign countries, one of them in Europe, against the background of the war in Ukraine and the refinement to which classic armored war vehicles are being re-acquired. This is the first time that Merkava tanks will be sold to a European country.

The Ministry of Defense does not specify the names of the two countries that agreed on the purchase of more than 200 used Israeli tanks in light of the sensitivity of the process, but the deal is on the verge of a final signature and is expected to be completed relatively immediately, within about three months. Officials at the Ministry of Defense told Ynet that since certain mechanical parts in these tanks are American-made, especially the engine, approval from the Ministry of Defense in Washington is required to carry out the transaction.

According to estimates, the scope of the deal will reach several tens of millions of dollars for all the tanks, an amount that will enter the state coffers and will probably be transferred directly to the defense establishment. This is an amount that is considered negligible in relation to the purchase of new western tanks. For the sake of proportion, about a decade ago, the Ministry of Defense offered a foreign army to purchase a new Mark 4 Merkava tank, from the production line, for approximately four million dollars per tank.

details indicate that the two transactions will be split - one will include the older Merkava 2 tanks and the other the Merkava Mark 3 that entered service in the nineties and served mainly the fighters of the 188th Brigade. In recent years these tanks have fallen out of use and today all 3 regular armored brigades - 401, 188 and 7th Brigade - equipped with advanced Merkava Mark 4 tanks with the active defense system against anti-tank missiles, of the wind jacket type and computerized command and control systems.

Some of the regular tanks, especially those with less experience, were transferred to reserve brigades, including the 10th (Harel) brigade instead of the tanks. However, more than 200 orphaned tanks remain in the IDF's maintenance depots. At first, the defense establishment was pessimistic about the possibility of a foreign army purchasing them, and the possibility of selling them to iron recycling contractors was considered, but not before they were scrapped. But the counter-armaments will strengthen them well and at the same time the war between Russia and Ukraine broke out last year, which changed the security needs of European countries. Initial interest in used tanks began already in the middle of last year and the Ministry of Defense rushed to check the condition of the old tanks, and found that they were serviceable enough to be sold.



It is difficult to sell military surpluses, we try to prolong their lives as much as possible

"It is difficult to sell military surpluses, we try to prolong their lives as much as possible"

( Photo: IDF spokesman )

Security officials explained that "producing a tank as an off-the-shelf product is a complex and long process that can take two years and cost a fortune, in our time there are tanks that are qualified, with receipts, for operation tomorrow morning, in open and built-up areas." The sources also said that "Europe is in an arms race that has not been the same since World War II." For example, the German Ministry of Defense tripled its defense budget because of the tensions with Russia, while Sweden and Finland join NATO, and only yesterday the Israeli Ministry of Defense reported an all-time record in the sale of Israeli weapons to the world - approximately 12.5 billion dollars in the past year.

It should be noted that in the IDF's warehouses there are still hundreds of M-113 APCs that are also going out of use, in light of the introduction of the NMR and Eitan APCs in recent years, mainly to the regular brigades. For these APCs, which are not considered protected from anti-tank fire, there is still no foreign demand. At the same time, in recent years, Israel has succeeded in promoting the sale of decommissioned Air Force F-16 aircraft to the Croatian army. The security officials stated that "it is difficult to sell military surpluses, and we are trying to be attractive and extend their lives as much as possible."

The first chariot tanks, the product of the development of Major General Israel Tal (Telik) and the engineer Israel Tilan, were produced in Israel in the late 1970s, and their first version, the Mark 1, was integrated into operational activity already in the First Lebanon War, during Operation Peace of the Galilee. Immediately after that, the Ministry of Defense developed the follow-up version, Mark 2, with improvements that allowed warfare even in built-up areas, and with additions for passive protection. Regular and reserve armored personnel carriers recorded thousands of successful battles in chariot tanks in all recent Israeli systems, in the security zone in Lebanon, in Operation Protective Wall, in the Second Lebanon War, in operations in the Gaza Strip before and after disengagement, as well as in ongoing security in the various sectors.
Magyarul?Telon nincs fordító